Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign.
[00:00:09] Speaker B: Welcome to the second half of week four's worth of course content. We are extremely fortunate to be joined today by Mike Oxy. He's going to be speaking to us about his experience through hockey and his stories of who he's represented in his time throughout the playing the game. Mike and you can spell his last name, A U, K S I first name Mike. Mike Oxy is how you pronounce it. Mike's a good friend of mine and an excellent storyteller and I'm extremely excited to introduce you to him. He's a Toronto born Anishinaabe Estonian PhD student in kinesiology at McGill, focusing on indigenous sport and physical culture. His anticipated dissertation on the hockey history of Laxoul First Nation explores the game's importance in the people's lives and celebrate over 70 years of hockey excellence. Mike's playing career took him to U Sports, the Allen cup and and played internationally in the double ihf. And I think he's a very familiar storyteller. I think you'll recognize though his, his particular voice as a, as a hockey voice you might be familiar with. If you're not familiar with, with the way that hockey people talk. This is a very typical example of that. Mike's an excellent resource when it comes to playing internationally on a journey through youth sports in a really unconventional way in which you can experience the hockey industry.
You're going to be doing something similar in this week's audio response. So again, I'll warn you at the front here, if you hear something that you find interesting and that you'd like to compare to your previous speaker, the speaker of course being Ryan Creeland from the East Coast Hockey League. Make sure you write something down. Make sure you note something down during this guest lecture as well, because you are going to be comparing the two at the end of these guest lectures. So keep your mind sharp. Again, if you're walking around listening to this, if you're at the gym, just write it down on your phone. Remember in your head what time it was that you said something interesting and you're going to be comparing these two. Also at the end of this audio lecture, we're going to go over your next writing assignment which will also have an outline posted already on brightspace and that is for your Niagara Ice Dogs community engagement project. So we're going to be going over that as soon as you're done with Mike. With that said, enjoy Mike's lecture. And if you've got any questions for Mike afterwards, he noted to me that he Want, he'd be happy to answer questions from all of you. Send me an email and I'll pass it along to Mike and he'd be happy to answer. That actually goes for the majority of these speakers. If you've got a question for them, send me an email and I can introduce you to them. And they'd be happy. Most of them are extremely good about getting back to emails right away, so enjoy Mike's guest lunch.
[00:02:38] Speaker C: We are joined by Mike Auxi, a PhD candidate at McGill University. Mike, thanks so much for joining us.
[00:02:45] Speaker A: Hey, thanks. Thanks for having me. Looking forward to a good chat.
[00:02:48] Speaker C: Absolutely. Mike, if you could, could you take us back to your earliest memory of hockey? What's your first experience playing hockey or your first memory of playing on the ice at all?
[00:03:02] Speaker A: Yeah, I guess that, like, the kids in my area, like, I grew up in Toronto, kind of close to the downtown University of Toronto.
My friends, they were just playing. And the only reason why I even started playing was because, you know, one of the mothers was like, hey, do you think Michael would like to try ice hockey?
And that's kind of what happened. And so, yeah, just playing house league Timbits Team Red, you know, and just being with your friends and, you know, not being very good, you know, everybody learns to skate and develops in their own way. But, you know, those are. Those are good times for sure. I think we won the championship in the first year, too. I didn't do anything, so good memories.
[00:03:50] Speaker C: That's fantastic. When did you start feeling like, you know what, I like hockey. I'm going to keep doing this. Like, do you have any memories that sort of feeling like, hey, I like this. And also, I might be pretty good at this.
[00:04:02] Speaker A: Yeah, I guess, because, like, you know, if you, if you've played, played hockey and you've gone through it, you know that, like, you gotta go to the clinics, right? And like, there was Hockey Tech International. It was owned by a Czechoslovakian or the former Czechoslovakia, Martin Maglie. And like, he really was nice to, like, me and my mom and stuff. And like, I just, at first I didn't like power skating at all. And I was like, after the first session, I said to my mom, I'm gonna quit right now. And she's like, well, I'll tell you what, I will give you a Nintendo game for every time you go to power skating once a week and don't complain. And that was. That was it.
So she, she bribed me with that. And.
And then, yeah, I just. She even said to me a few months ago. She's like, you didn't take to anything like you did to hockey, but there was something about it that was like, yeah, like this spell is actually like, you know, committed to something. You know, even if you're having a hard time in school, like the game has always been something that, that I've quite en with my friends or even alone, like on an outdoor pad. So it's a very, very special pastime for me.
[00:05:14] Speaker C: Fantastic. So you took to the game when you did start playing it relatively quickly.
Was there something about the early days of playing the game that you miss now? Is there something that you missed from that time?
[00:05:33] Speaker A: The. I guess like just, you know, in.
Given the, given the times and the kinds of restrictions that, that, you know, we have to, you know, be, keep safe and best practices nowadays. I mean, no, because, because when, when you do get your like, you know, staff hockey at McGill Monday afternoon crew together, like you get the same feeling.
Right? And I, if I'm just like losing my mind in my, in my apartment.
And just the other last week I was like, I'm going to wake up at 6:30 and I'm going to go on the outdoor pad by myself. That's all I need, right? Like, you know, not that I need it, but I wasn't going to go. And then I was like, you know, the, you know, you have, you're in the battle, you're like, do I go? Do I not go? It snowed last night and I was like, you have to go, yes, you do need it. And there I am just like pushing the net around, clearing a space for myself, like, this is mine, nobody else's. Right?
And it feels the exact same as when you were a kid. So I mean it's, it's beautiful. They have the nets out at Jean Mont by, by Mount Royal there. So. And you got to work for it. It's a 25 minute walk uphill to get there.
[00:06:48] Speaker C: That's, I mean that's a. What are therapeutics? We're going to come back to that a little bit later.
[00:06:53] Speaker A: That's fantastic.
[00:06:54] Speaker C: Take us through your career though. So you start playing at a young age. Take us through your journey through hockey.
[00:07:02] Speaker A: All right. Well, yeah, like so with the hockey clinics obviously, like I started to, you know, be.
Have an opportunity to like, you know, play in the. Back then it was MTHL Metro Toronto Hockey League. Now it's Greater Toronto Hockey League. And yeah, I got my start with the eastenders tie Cats single A in in my Adam year.
The years were a little bit different. Back then, so I was about 10 or 11 and I'm a late birthday and then the second season in my minor peewee. When, when body checking started, we got the promotion to Double A. So it was a nice little seamless, you know, entry point into slightly more competitive. And then, yeah, just played around Double A in the, in the mthl, Scarborough Bruins, Scarborough Stallions.
Because I don't know if anyone saw like Michael Bunting the other day on Hockey Day in Canada. Like everything he was saying, I was like, what? I played for the Thai Cats. Like, you know, and everything he was saying, it just kind of. And he was just. I just like the way he plays too. But anyways, yeah, and I just. I played majority, mostly Double A. One year of Triple A, it was the Mississauga Rebels first year, like 95, 96, you know, like one year in super competitive hockey. And it kind of took the wind out of my sails, you know, like six days a week going from downtown Toronto to Mississauga to like everywhere, you know, and we didn't even have a car, so it's a lot of like subway rides and stuff. And I mean it was great, but it just. The Double A pace was always been kind of more my thing. It's like, you don't have to, it's not, you're not like, like just getting torn into just because you don't win a game. And like it's. I don't know.
I always wanted to like, just like push myself because I wanted to, not because necessarily someone else was telling me to.
So anyways, but. But that was the cool thing. So then I just. I took a half year off, went back to go Canucks Double A and then played with them for my midget years. And then.
And then played like juvenile Triple A, which was like Junior B, Junior C, but in downtown Toronto. Right. This is kind of like a.
It had a reputation for being like a super tough league, you know, like the inner city kids. Like not, not quite maybe good enough to play Junior A or obviously major junior, but. But good. Like sort of outcast and outliers from like the downtown core and the outskirts. But that was a night, a nice pace for me and whatever. And then, yeah, I just kind of. That's when it's over, right? Like when you're, when you can't play junior or juvenile anymore, usually like, you know, it's kind of like you're gonna do other stuff but just not to. Not to be too, too long winded. But. But I did was. I was lucky to to walk onto an Allen cup team with the Brantford blast in 03 04.
Right? And like, senior hockey is like, pretty hardcore. Like, a lot of people, ex pros, ex college, XU sports, everything like that got caught after nine games, which was when I realized, like, hey, if I, if I can get into university, maybe I can walk on to U of T, right? And that's kind of where like, the youth sports and like, like the opportunity to take the dream back happened for me.
[00:10:44] Speaker B: So you go, you had to.
[00:10:46] Speaker C: Sorry, sorry about that.
So you had to.
You leave the senior circuit. You had to. Collegiate hockey at that point, CIS hockey.
So tell us about that. What was that process like when you first arrived at U of T's campus and look to walk on to the varsity blues? Was that an adjustment for you? What, was the playing style different? Was the. Were your teammates different? Or did you know, some of the players.
[00:11:12] Speaker A: I had, I had played in like this, this Brampton Powerade center summer hockey tournament. It was like, run by Brian Spencer, just an absolute beaut. And we actually beat like a team with like, Spetsa Daly and like, Ray Emery. The late, great Ray Emery was their goalie. Nathan Parrott from the Leafs, you know, he had some, he could chuck the knuckles, but we took him out. We had a team of like college collegiate guys.
Corey Pecker was with, like the Cincinnati Mighty Ducks. Like, we had a pretty sweet team. And the assistant coach for U of T was on that team. And I was kind of like, hey, man, like, can you kind of stick your neck out for me? Like, tell coach I'm coming, you know, and, you know, he was kind of like, yeah, he didn't really say nothing, but. But I kind of. You know, sometimes it's important to announce yourself because I left a message with coach Darren Lowe too, saying, hey, my name is Mike Oucy, I'm 6ft 200 pounds, playing senior.
I just, I just got released from Brantford, last in the senior league and whatever. And when I showed up to camp, there was one hour, an open tryout with like, just dreamers, you know, like, like me and. And then with five minutes to go, that same coach, Ben Barrett, goes, hey, if you're ever gonna, if you're ever going to do something, you all have one more shift left, you might as well do it now. And I'm not like a rusher with the puck. I'm not an offensive. I'm like a shot blocking, like, hitting, defending, you know, I'll get my cookies when I get my cookies. Like with assists and goals. But, like, I just took the pucket center ice. I danced two guys, and then I slipped the puck home, backhand on the ice, came around the corner, didn't even celebrate. And I was like, the last guy to see coach. And he's like. He's like, how do you think you did? I'm like, I think I did all right, but I got so much more to give, like, something like that.
And, yeah, I was the last guy to see coach. And he's like, what? And he just kind of had that smile. He's like, we're gonna keep you around for a little longer.
Because I think. I think he really. He liked to keep guys around that were, like, super hungry, that could play, that would push the guys that were more regulars. Because I. For three years, I really didn't get a regular shift at U of T, which can sometimes wear on you, right? You know, you become the Rudy, you know?
How did.
[00:13:29] Speaker C: How did your relationship to hockey change playing at UoT?
Or did it change at all, I should say?
[00:13:36] Speaker A: Well, that's a cool question, pal, because, like, that was, like, kind of early in, like, my sobriety, like, so I quit drinking in 2003, and basically, hockey, like, I used it, you know, as something to kind of, like, keep sober and. And keep healthy in that.
And I guess it changed a bit, but, I mean, it was like, I wasn't even playing in games, so I was just using it as development time and stuff, you know, and some of the guys were cool. Some of the guys were a little bit weird around me. It's just like, oh, this guy's, like, making us work so hard, and he's a healthy. You know, sometimes it's like that, you know, and it's. It's.
It can happen. But no, I mean, it was just a big adjustment because I was like. I looked at our calendar to my. And I looked at my buddy. I'm like, hey, we have to come here six days a week. He's like, oh, yeah.
Or like, all these systems, like D to D, quick up, reverse, hard reverse, middle, you know, the commands for breakouts or. Or 1, 2. Two neutral zone traps, and, like, the go play on a penalty kill or a jailbreak on a defensive zone, face off are all things that I had never learned. Right? In double A and juvenile, you just play.
And so I really got to learn a lot about systems that I would have gotten in junior, but I didn't spend time playing Junior. Right.
[00:15:03] Speaker C: So would you say that when you were playing CIS at hockey at that Point again, now called U Sports.
Did your appreciation for the more esoteric parts of the game increase? Like, did you appreciate locker room dynamics differently now that you're playing with grown men? Because this is something that when you talk to players that start playing with men, that the locker room dynamic changes or sometimes it doesn't change, depending on what setup it is. Did the dynamics inside the locker room change a bit now that you were playing with people that are mostly your age. Exactly. Or, you know, in your age range, but all grown men?
[00:15:42] Speaker A: That's a good question. Yeah, for sure.
Actually, like, I was, let's see, already by 0405, which was my first season at U of T, like I was already 22, turning 23 by December. So I was one of the older guys.
We happen to have like a 29, 30 year old goalie. You know who it was. It was quite an interesting dynamic, but I'd say I was one of the older guys and like being a non drinker, being like, you know, I was, I was really focused on school because it's like, you know, sometimes you have like scholarships that you want to try to win if you can get better grades.
Yeah, sometimes it was, it was, it was a weird dynamic. And being, being like a depth player, you know, it really can be tricky dynamics wise. But you know what, Overall, like, people were. All the folks were. All the. My teammates were pretty cool to me and I was always, well, even with, like with Ryerson Moore and later in Europe, they would always like. And we were on the road, they would always put me with the goalies. The goalies really liked my calm demeanor, you know, which is always a kind of a neat little roundabout compliment, you know, just slightly going off track there.
[00:16:57] Speaker C: Oh, that's awesome. Everyone knows that goalies are their own breed of person. They are. So to be, to be deemed worthy enough to even speak to them is a huge compliment. So you make the jump to Ryerson. Any differences in that? Because I know obviously it's not that huge of a geographic swap, but did your experiences shift any way at all heading to Ryerson?
[00:17:20] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, it's just, it's a slightly different, you know, dynamic, you know, going from a U of T to, to a Ryerson.
You know, I'll just sort of say that it was maybe just a little more laid back, you know, and, and that's. The hockey cultures were different too. Right. So like Ryerson had just been coming off like some of the worst seasons like in university hockey history. I'm talking like you go to you go to UQTR and you have two lines. That's going to be a bad day for you, you know, playing the top teams. And Quebec, you're going to be losing 12 1. You're not going to be feeling really good about yourself.
But in the 0708 season, the year that I transferred, I was pretty pumped. I played in all 34 games, including, like, games against, like, American colleges and. And, yeah, I mean, he brought in guys like, whatever. I was a transfer, a couple of guys from UHL and stuff.
And we got some big wins, you know, against, like, Waterloo, who was ninth in the country, Western, who was six in the country. Like, you know, and it was. It was. I was really pretty pumped to be part of, like, that. That. If you look at Ryerson now, it literally started that season when it was like, hey, you know, Ryerson's never again going to be the laughing stock in hockey.
[00:18:44] Speaker B: Fantastic.
[00:18:45] Speaker C: So you moved from U of T. Your role is obviously a little bit different at Ryerson. You're given more of an ownership of that team. Does that change the way that you feel about the game? Does that push you further because your career sort of takes off again after that?
What did the experience at Ryerson alter your relationship with hockey or sort of change who you saw yourself as a hockey player?
[00:19:06] Speaker A: It's funny you say that. You know the Western game when we won 5 2, I had my uncle there and some friends from Oneida there, some community friends.
And I remember getting ready for that game and just thinking, like, I don't. I don't want to play in this game.
And the reason why I was feeling like that is kind of weird. It's almost like, okay, I am a hockey player. I'm in my mid-20s, and this is like, everything I always wanted, all that practice and training and just to get to U of T and to. And to sit on the bench and to record games and to do stats and things that most people feel are embarrassing, but, like.
And then the moment came to be in the game, and it was like, mid season already. And I'm like, I don't even want to do this. I just want to train for this.
And I don't even understand why that was, but I can just tell you all that. That's how I felt in that moment.
Hey, you got a 52 win against the nationally ranked team. It's amazing.
And Western, they would, like, chip the puck in the corner. Hey, like, soft in the corner. So, you know when a puck just comes into the corner and just Stops and it's probably upright against the wall and you have to go and pitchfork it off and there's a 6 foot 4, 220 pound gorilla. I took some of the biggest hits I've ever taken in that game because hey, if you don't get the puck, you're going to get, you're going to get benched. But there was no head targeting. They were just hard, clean, like you're playing with, you know, like ex pros. And the western teams have historically been strong.
So all that is to say that my relationship to the game was.
It's always been a little bit complex but, but to play in all those games, like I said, and the coolest was, you know, going back to U of T for the last game of the season and U of T had to win to get like a playoff bye to, to the second round and then ended up coming out with the shootout winner at varsity arena. So that was pretty, pretty unreal.
[00:21:12] Speaker B: That's awesome. That's.
[00:21:13] Speaker C: I mean, I want to go back to something you brought up earlier, this notion of like how therapeutic the game is for you now and maybe what's for you. When you were younger, did you still, and you mentioned how hockey was sort of a help for you with your sobriety.
Did playing hockey with university at the university level, did the game remain therapeutic to you or did it become more of a job?
[00:21:44] Speaker A: Yeah, I mean, I don't think it ever felt like a job. Like, I mean it was like as a, as a doctoral student now, like one of the tough things is like when all your projects and tasks are kind of out there and trying to bring them down to the ground. Whereas like if you're playing, you know, you sports any sport and work in and playing hockey and you have family obligations, there's no time and so you just get it done and you sleep good usually too.
So.
No, it was, it was, it was fine. It was fine. But then again, like I got cut the next year after that, that winning goal. Right. Like, that's, that's the reality. Yeah, I didn't train as hard in the summer I had, you know, and you know, coaches always bring in new guys. That's the reality of competitive sport as well. But, but after I got over the initial disappointment and devastation, you know, it's like, it's like it never goes the way you think it's going to go. But then I realized I was like, oh man, like I have so much time to do other really fascinating things.
Getting involved with student politics, being one of Them I got a chance to learn that, you know, it's probably not for me, but it's still good to do it and to be involved and to go up to a debate and go toe, toe what I want, you know.
It wasn't that kind of a debate though, just in all transparency. But I remember the young lady who went before me, she nailed off all these points of things she was going to do. And I'm like, all right, she's pretty good. I get up there. I didn't say anything like tangible or feasible, but just like, my tone was just like, oh, if you're looking for someone who's gonna go, go to bat for you, like, throw me a vote, you know. And I remember when me and my buddy got elected to like, it was like the community services board of directors or whatever it was. It's like, how many votes did we get, fella? And it was just like 25 and 26. Like, you know, you think it's gonna be like a couple hundred at least. Nobody even wrote it right.
All your buddies that said they were going to. It's like that Simpsons episode. Hey, one for Martin, two for Martin.
[00:23:56] Speaker C: That's a hard lesson about student, student government. But you know what? Like, that's a, that's leadership again. And you mentioned that again, that like, look, I'm here to work hard. That was your mantra when you arrived at ut. You mentioned. So I mean, it's fitting. And then you make the jump at that point from Ryerson to a vastly different hockey landscape. Can you speak to that journey you end up in?
[00:24:18] Speaker B: Is that.
[00:24:19] Speaker C: That was in the Czech, Czech Republic league at that point. Right. You make your jump. How does that happen? How does that change your hockey experience?
[00:24:28] Speaker A: Yeah, certainly very enriching. I certainly didn't, didn't stay for too long. But yeah, basically I had been in school with U of T and Ryerson for like five straight years and it was just like, I'm not going back in September. I got to take a break. And I was like, I know, I'll go use my contacts and get out to like check third league, which is.
I don't know how I would compare it. I would, I would say it would be like, not, not Allen cup senior hockey, maybe like, like lower level senior hockey in Canada. But the top lines, they've got some awesome players. Like, I think it would surprise Canadians anyways. So whatever. I go out there and yeah, it was just a tricky situation in the sense of like 30 minute walk to the rink and back every day. The super cute town Ceska Lipa, 100 clicks north of Prague.
And yeah, ended up just coming home. It just, just wasn't a comfortable situation for me. And at the time, my mom had to, to bail me out with like the, the flight cost that, you know, I, she said, what would you do if I, if I didn't bail you out right now? Like, kind of really like teaching me that lesson. I'm just like, I'm not just, I'm not always going to be here to like, bail you out of a situation like this. And I said, well, you know, I'd stay and survive and help the team if I could, but. But a lot of the fellas who came from North America did end up leaving, if not after a month, after like two weeks, after two months. It just wasn't too comfortable of a situation. But I don't know, I look back on it and I. Sometimes I wish I'd stayed too, you know, just to kind of see what possibilities can happen. But, but it was, it was a very interesting look at, at the way it is.
I know I had a pal, I had a pal come in who was a very excellent player and like, as soon as he got there, got, got scooped up by another team and he got stranded out there for a couple of months, you know what I'm saying? Like, it's no joke, right? And I went to grab him at the airport and like, kind of took him so that the other team didn't take him so we could have one night, you know, with the boys.
I'm telling you, like, you know, it makes sense. You know, at that point he becomes an asset to another team who might be looking for a promotion to second league. That's, that's minor pro, like the lower league, Europe. That's what happens.
And people, like, all people from like North America want to go to Europe and try, like, oh, like, you know, the, the, the prestige of like playing overseas, like, and it's good, it's good, it's life experience, you know, it's.
You learn different culture, you become buddies with new people and they're all just like, why would you come here? And then they're just like, yeah, we want to come there and come to the Federal.
So it's really an interesting kind of grass is greener situation, but that's, that's how it is, you know.
[00:27:47] Speaker C: Definitely. And that's not the end of your European journey, though. And then you travel to a nation that I'm not sure many Canadians are familiar with, with, with Estonia and this becomes a much larger part of your life, certainly with the way you end up representing Estonia more broadly. So tell us about that journey to Estonia. What brings you back to Europe after you. It came back from the checklist.
[00:28:11] Speaker A: Okay, pal, So I believe.
Don't hold me to this, but. So I was able to get my Estonian passport, like EU passport, I think, before I went to check. Right. So it's like, usually it's like obviously to your advantage to do that, that if you go to a European hockey league that like, you're not going to be an import, for instance, you're not gonna have like restrictions, like 90 days or you know, visa, you're not paying insurance the same way.
And. But basically when I got back from Czech in like September or October of 2010, I'm like, all right, I'm done. I'm not even gonna play anymore. This is very.
I'm done.
I don't know. That didn't last long. And I went, I took a one, it was a two way ticket from Toronto to Estonia to Tallinn, which is just south of Finland. And I showed up at the national team training camp because I had my citizenship and I wanted to sort of announce myself to the Estonian national hockey program. And I did good. I did good. I played in one exhibition game.
Pro team from Belarus beat us 5, 1.
So it was, you know, obviously a pretty good little team. And.
And I did good. I felt really good and actually played a second game against.
Nevermind, that was another year. But long story short, when you get a new citizenship in hockey, right, you need to live and play in the country for two seasons and then you can register for the national program, you know, and if you look at the team China, who's comprised mostly of the Kunlun Red Star, the China owned team from the khl, that's what's happening there. So whether you have like Spencer and Parker Fu, you have Brendan yet, those fellas, because they're, they're Chinese or part Chinese, they can get their international transfer cards quicker than like Jake Chalios, Chris Chalios's son, who's actually playing on Team China, right? So it's really interesting because a lot of people would say, oh, they're all made up of like, you know, expats and transfers and things like that. But if you acquire citizenship for excellence in sport, for living there and to the IHS mandate of like growing the sport, like that's the point. So people don't just get passports and parachute in for two weeks and parachute out. What are you actually doing, you know, and I was involved with, like, minor hockey and Estonia and stuff, and those kids come and cheer you on at the game, and that's what it's about because you don't even know what you mean to those kids.
You know, you see them later, like, a couple years down the road, and they're just doing great, and they grew up so fast, and it's.
You know, it makes sure that you. You get the most out of your.
Your overseas experience. But, yeah, short story long, I guess, pal. I. I came back, I finished my Bachelor of Social Work and Master of Social Work at Ryerson, and like, a month after I was done my master's, I was on a plane to Estonia to play those two seasons.
And, yeah, it just.
Those are some pretty cool years, you know, Like. Like, family putting you up in their extra apartment so that you only have to pay, like, gas, water, electricity, and an Internet cable that keeps the expenses down, you know, getting a job, personal training at a gym, coaching kids off court tennis for, like, €40 an hour. So you only work, like, six to eight hours a week, but you're making more than enough to, like, go to the groceries, go to the movies, you know, but. But you have to go there to, like, to do it, you know, it's not like everything, hey, you're just gonna have this. You're gonna have a job, you're gonna have a car, you're gonna have a bicycle. Like, you just have to go. And that's what that was the mindset.
So.
So it was. It was amazing. And after the two seasons, at Christmas time, before the World Championships in 2015, I was like, I can't do it. I'm just gonna go home. I. I wanted to quit.
And I guess the best player in Estonian hockey right now, Robert Roba, he's like, in the. In the KHL for a team called Shreveports. I forget what their whole name is. He's first Estonian to play in the cage.
He goes. He goes.
You're saying you're telling me you're not emotionally ready to play Division 1B World Championships? The hockey's not even that good, you know, that was his approach.
He said, get yourself ready and come to camp. Right? So when I got the call to come to camp, I was so fired up, and I was ready. I. I got in, like, unimaginably good shape because it was kind of like. It felt like I would die if I didn't make that team. Like, it was just, like, to come that far. And I was just A piece of iron. Like, I could have run through a wall. I shaved like a mohawk in my head, too, just to, like, do something crazy, you know, and just to show them.
And. And it was a good. It was a good world championship.
Eindhoven, Netherlands, an hour bus ride outside of Amsterdam, and it came down to the last game to see who was going to get relegated to fourth division. And we took them out 3:1 in regulation to.
To not get relegated. And it's. It's actually kind of sad because Netherlands hasn't been back up. They've been back up once in the third division of competition since 2015, and I was there when they had the tournament in Estonia in 2019.
So it's because if you get relegated, it's. It's two years before you get back up because you got to play in the lower and win that it can set your program back. Right?
[00:34:35] Speaker C: Oh, my goodness. I mean, that. That's something. Again, I'm not sure that many Canadian hockey fans.
[00:34:39] Speaker A: No, no. No one knows. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:34:42] Speaker B: So tell me. That's. That's fantastic.
[00:34:44] Speaker C: That story you had about, you know, you're ready to leave.
[00:34:47] Speaker A: It's.
[00:34:48] Speaker C: I'm sure that it was a, you know, that they were treated well in Estonia, but, you know, wanting to come home is understandable. But then you come back and you've sort of. You mentioned there that you have a sense of identity with that team. You really seem to have a real sense of belonging. You wanted to run through a wall for that Estonian team. Did you find yourself feeling a part of that sort of Estonian family? Maybe you can speak more broadly to what was the hockey culture like there? Did you feel like you had become a part of that family, or was that something that maybe you wanted to develop on your own?
[00:35:23] Speaker A: Good question, Buddy.
I think it's always kind of an interesting dynamic, right, because there's a lot of fierce competition, too. Like, you're not going to be like, buddy, buddy with all the other defensemen on the team because you're jockeying for positions and stuff. So sometimes, you know, plus I'm like this Canadian guy, you know, it's like, it's a little bit of a dynamic, but for the most part, man, like, hockey really became like a personal mission where, like, hey, you can be cool to me, you can. You can be rotten to me. It really makes no difference because.
Because, you know, I know, like, what, like, I'm capable of doing, and I know how to make teams, and I make teams by being a good teammate. Being that you know, glue guy, as they always say.
And it's like, if you're good enough to make a team and be, like, negative and pick on people and, like, break the team apart as opposed to bring it together. Well, kudos to you. You're probably pretty good, you know, and.
But I just. I've never understood, like, wow, you couldn't be, like, the best possible teammate, you know, That's, I think, what people, like, know me as. And it's like, like, why not? And I know it's. It can help teams like, to win and stuff and just have a better time because it all happens quick and it's.
It goes quick.
And I was lucky to.
To play, like, at the.
The peak in my mid-30s, but I didn't have to, like, you know, I was able to do a lot of other things along the way, so I was thankful that it's not hockey players, not all I've ever been.
[00:37:14] Speaker B: And it's.
[00:37:15] Speaker C: You talk to people who played the game. Rarely are they able to articulate who they are so well. I mean, I've talked to hundreds of people who've played all over the place at every level, and a lot of them, especially when they leave the game in an organized sense, in terms of playing, they struggle saying, like, okay, well, I could define myself through hockey, but it's hard for me to define myself outside of the game. And that's true for athletes across the board. Did you find yourself. Did you know who you were when you left playing the game, or did you find yourself struggling to identify who am I outside of being a player?
[00:37:57] Speaker A: That's a good question, pal.
I think, like, when I got cut From Ryerson in 0809, you know, I was really fortunate to be able to go to, like, feasts and gatherings and teachings at Ryerson Indigenous Student Services. Right. And so.
And doing ceremonies, like. Like, sweat lodge ceremonies and, like, really hardcore, like, outdoorsy things that I did when I was working in child welfare, Indigenous child welfare in Toronto as well.
And so those are the experiences that have made it, like, easier.
But for sure, it was hard when. When it's over, right? And, like, you, like, all right, well, I have no more international tournament to look forward to. You're like, why would I go to a gym?
There's absolutely no point in any of this, you know, and it's like, even today, you know, a little bit of weight gain, you know, feeling kind of. Feeling kind of down, and it's like, you don't. You're not gonna go to.
And you don't want to train the way you did, but you, you want it, you want something in between and you're still looking for it. And I'm coming up on six years since my last international game, and it was on Valentine's Day, you know, but, but I was really, when I, when I stepped away, like from, from, from the sport competitively, there's something really empowering about like that that came from me and it was on my terms and if I'd held on too long, it would have, it would have been like I was done. Like there was no way I could have done it again because after my last Olympic qualifying tournament for the 2018 Games in Korea, I could have trained for another month and played in the second world championship.
But then it's like you're working a full time job, right?
And to train and the amount of pressure I would have put on myself to play like five games in seven days, you know, it was like the easiest choice to, to not keep doing it. Right.
[00:40:21] Speaker C: How would you.
[00:40:22] Speaker A: Just. For what, one more tournament, you know, of course.
[00:40:25] Speaker C: And just because again, you've been so generous with your time here. I want to wrap up with something and maybe we can hit back just to where you, you brought up what you're like right now. But what's your relationship to hockey right now? And is that different than what it was when you were playing Timbits and playing for the Tiger Cats and things like that, or has it changed dramatically since you've been all over the globe, playing all over the country as well? What's your relationship to hockey right now?
[00:40:53] Speaker A: It's pretty good. It's pretty good.
I've been watching, watching a little more than, than I was for a while.
So that's kind of interesting because I'm, I'm always like a more like I'd rather like play and do something than watch sports.
I.
Yeah, like when I go, when I go, you know, seven in the morning to the outdoor pad, I don't know, it's weird. It's like I don't go to play shinny. Like I see the games in the evenings and stuff, but I just go by myself. It's kind of weird or with a buddy passed around maybe, but I do that. And it's like you just feel like the exact same as you did when you were a kid, you know, or if you're a teenager going through some stuff, it was like, yeah, hockey was a place that could just kind of escape for a bit, you know, all the cliches. But that's that's how. How it feels.
Yeah.
If you. I like the Tim Hortons app. They have the NHL app where you can, like, pick shooters every night and win free coffee. So that keeps me interested as well. But that's.
[00:42:10] Speaker C: And again, the one final, final question, just because I want my students to be able to keep their eyes up for you as you, as you rise through the academic ranks.
[00:42:19] Speaker B: What's.
[00:42:19] Speaker C: How. How would you describe it in as brief terms as possible, the research that you're doing right now for your doctoral project?
[00:42:27] Speaker A: Yeah. Cool. So basically my doctoral work has to do with residential school ice hockey and its history. So my father, who played in residential school, see at Pelican Lake Indian Residential School in, in the 1960s.
Right. And so, you know, talking to him and eventually some of his, you know, his peers, we just really want to kind of explore, you know, like the, some of the meanings, you know, possibly, you know, that they would have. Would have made through playing sports in, in a tricky time, you know, being in residential school and, you know, the propensity for the various.
I just got a notification to work on a, on a presentation on my work.
But yeah, and what, how.
What kinds of sort of aspects of indigenous survivance, you know, how they would have used hockey to like, really, quite literally and figuratively, like, you know, survived the residential school experience, being disconnected from family and their homes and stuff. And, you know, I've known my dad all my life and it's.
He absolutely loves hockey, you know, easily as much as me. And, you know, with the whole pandemic, it's been hard because every holiday I would go down for like two weeks to see my dad and it was like, we're all juniors, Spanky, like Spangler cop.
That's all we do. And it'd be like midnight and we're watching like a midget Calgary AAA game.
So.
So that's, that's kind of what we're up to. Yeah.
[00:44:22] Speaker C: Mike, thank you so much again. And I really, I really appreciate your. You sharing your journey. And you might have one of the most unique perspectives of hockey out of.
[00:44:31] Speaker B: Anybody in the whole country.
[00:44:32] Speaker C: I mean, very few people have played the ways that you've played in the places that you've played them in. And I want to thank you on behalf of Spima at 4000 P97 for your time today.
[00:44:42] Speaker A: Thanks everyone.
Wishing you all, all the very best. And thanks for, thanks for tuning in. Appreciate it.
[00:44:55] Speaker B: Love chatting with Mike. He's a bit of a different kind of storyteller than Some of the other guest speakers you're going to hear this semester. I think sometimes when we, when we speak to people who are either involved in the media side or even on the sort of pro game, you can lose that kind of perspective. I think you got a little bit of that also from Corey. But it's important to consider some of the messages that Mike was getting at today. I think that there's a lot of Mike's journey that might feel familiar to you. There's a lot of Mike's life that's very unfamiliar to you. There's a lot of parts of his life that are different parts of his life that are very much the same part of his journey, where he's played, how he grew up. I mean, some of these things I think appear different on face. But I think when we analyze his journey through hockey and his story of who he represented throughout his career, I think he is a fascinating case study. And certainly if you have a chance to hear Mike speak, he does speaking tours often in around Ontario and in Quebec. Go, go listen to him if he's speaking at a conference or keep your eye out for him as his career develops. So now we are going to move to your next writing assignment, or it's sort of a writing assignment. It's also a bit of a project. If you've head to brightspace and you head to the assignments tab, you'll have a look at what's called the Ice Dogs Community engagement event assignment. There's an outline posted there. So again, if you've got your laptop, you can open it up right now. If you're not the laptops not in front of you right now, that's okay. You can listen to me talk about it. And then when you're back home or when you're back in front of your computer, you can pull it up. But I want to take some time going over that assignment right now.
So this is your next assignment that's going to be submitted. Your due dates, of course, on the course outline will be coming up relatively quickly. So I'd like you to start thinking about this right away. And this is a new assignment that I'm trying this year in conjunction with Michelle E. Eastman, who's going to be coming in to speak with us, who works with the Niagara Ice Dogs, former sport management student herself, and as just recent graduate, in fact, you might know her, she's helping us develop this, this project here. And it is based around the idea that there is a lot of excellent ideas and a lot of great sport Management knowledge in these rooms, certainly in this class, it's time to try and put some of this to work here and see if we can't forge lasting partnerships.
So the idea is basically to create an event proposal for the Niagara Ice Dogs that will further connect them with the Niagara region, strengthening existing and fostering new fan relationships. The idea being we have an outline posted here, and this assignment is going to give you a lot of freedom in terms of the way you present it.
What that means is there isn't one specific way that I'm looking for this assignment to be executed. The document itself that you can download here on the assignment, you can fill these boxes out and you can sort of go through that and just fill up the boxes and expand them more and more and more as you move through it. But those are. These are the key aspects of the assignment that I am looking for and I'll go through them one by one here.
So when you're planning this document, if you make this into a slide deck, in addition to a written document, you can fill these boxes out and include a slide deck. If you want to create a video, if you want to create any sort of paratextual material to accompany this, this, that would be great. I mean, the more creative, the better. This is not necessarily an essay that I'm looking for here.
The purpose. This is the mission or vision statement for the event which provides context for what is to follow in the event proposals. What it is, what is it that I should say that you are trying to accomplish with this event?
To that you have to set clear goals and objectives in order to. In order to know about what the event is and what it will accomplish to be able to measure its success.
The target audience, through demographics and other research, determine who the event is for in order to attract them. In this section, you are to consider what aspect of the target demographic is not being served currently by the ice dogs and why. Your event will help develop these new fan relationships include references to relevant sport management, scholarly literature that details how best to engage with this target demographic. There's a lot here. And by fourth year, you have certainly scanned a lot of scholarly literature that tells you about the various types of audiences that you could be missing out on. If you think that the ice dogs are missing out of a specific demographic, perhaps the elderly, perhaps people 18 to 25, perhaps it's people 40 to 60, perhaps it's young families. All of these types of audiences require a specific way of engaging with them. And that is something that we really would like. You to include in this event proposal. Demonstrate to the ice dogs that you have considered why it is this is a useful demographic to them. I mean perhaps there are some demographics that they are not interested in attracting.
Make an argument, make a case for why this is an important demographic to to target and why your event is actually going to do what you say it's going to do or why it's going to do the thing that will benefit the ice dogs. Moving on to event stakeholders, explain what role stakeholders will play in the successful execution of the event. Consider stakeholder theory. So here we'd like to know how stakeholders are going to be a part of what you are you're getting into here. And stakeholder theory, there's a definition provided there on the little box there to explain what we mean by stakeholders though by four theory you've gone over that a number of times. Certainly if you've been in my 3p05 class, we spoke about that. Or if you've been in the event planning courses. I'm sure they've talked about stakeholders before.
The event schedule here we need a detailed timeline of the event so that stakeholders can see you have the plans for every detail.
You may choose any format of timeline you like as long as the dates and plan for the event are clear.
So what we need here is a sense that you have an idea of how long this was going to take to execute the event itself. And in this sense you can create your own own timeline here you can create your own document style. I'm not looking for one specific one because it depending on your event it's probably going to look different. So here I am again asking you to be creative and I one thing that this goes for essentially every aspect of this assignment. What I don't really want is receive, you know, a whole bunch of emails in two or three days before the due date saying well what are you looking for for this one thing? What are you looking for for timeline? It it is I'm asking you to to be creative and be sensitive to the flexibility required to actually execute this event. Your timeline, the way that you present it will be unique to the event that you choose. So it's very important that you consider again how best to demonstrate the evidence of success, the measurables, the goals, all of those things depending on the event that you're creating.
Event marketing, promotion. Highlight the marketing and promotion you plan to do for the event.
Demonstrate your knowledge of the Ice Dogs product by researching and referencing past events how held by the Ice doc. So have a look online, see what they like to do, see what they've done in the past. Because what we don't want to do is submit any of these things and have them essentially say, well, we've already done that, we've tried it six years ago, we tried it four years ago, we tried it last year, and they're not working. So have a look around. And here, when you do find an event that you'd like to build off of or model on, maybe you said that I want to do an event that captures specifically the South Asian community. Well, I want to do it the same way that you did it with an event that talked specifically to another community or perhaps even another minority group. So that's where you want to reference that specifically the value proposition. And this one again is related to the target audience here, certainly. But from the perspective of attendees, show how the show how you will design the event to appeal to their wants, interests and need. Why would someone want to show up to this? Why would someone from your target demographic Want to attend KPIs? I know you've talked about key performance indicators and the past and other courses. So I'm going to need key performance indicators you'll use to measure the value of the event and prove that it meets the event's goals and objectives. I've provided a fairly lengthy description of what a KPI is underneath this assignment here. So if you're confused about what KPI is or how it best applies here, underneath there the assignment outline, there's a long, lengthy description of what that is. And finally, how much is this event going to cost?
So, and you can again display this in any way that you choose. It is important again to note to you that I am not looking for any one type of assignment here. I'm asking you here as fourth year students to be creative.
You can display this in any way. But make sure that we have the key requests that we've asked for in those boxes. If you so choose to just expand those boxes and use that word document as your guide, that's totally fine. You're free to do so.
If you'd like to do that and include paratextual material, I would encourage you to do that as well. In terms of things like a word count, Again, don't necessarily focus so much on the word count. It needs to be as long as it needs to be. If it is, I'm assuming you can do all this all in 200 words. This doesn't need to be 10,000 words. Okay? This is something that it's not so much about any sort of specific writing requirement. We have a writing assignment that follows this. This is about do the kind of work that you need to do to make sure that this outline is sufficient. I'll be going over the details for this assignment again next week and where you can free to ask me any question you like over email or you're free to ask me any question you like during office hours. We'll also have a guest lecture from Michelle where she's going to be talking a little bit about her time with the Ice Dogs and perhaps even the details of this assignment in even more detail next week. But for now, get started thinking about it. Get started thinking what you might like to do. Start looking around what the Ice Dogs have done. And the most important part here is the. The proposals themselves are going to be issued to Michelle, specifically, the ones that I believe have the best shot at successful execution if it is, in fact, if one of yours is chosen, you may be working with Michelle that actually worked and trying to develop this event. And that's something that I think is a great opportunity for you as you enter fourth year of this, of this program. So that's the sort of assignment. We're going to be talking about it again in detail throughout next week. Get started thinking about it. And now we're going to move on to your audio response question.
[00:54:41] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:54:41] Speaker B: For this week's audio response, I want you to respond to our two guest lecturers that came in and had a discussion with me over this past week, and that's Mike Oxey and Ryan Creelin. Very different topics, very different subject matter, but they do address something that I think links them both quite significantly. And that is our course topic from this week, the notion of who do you play for? So Ryan talks specifically about the kind of fans that he wanted to connect with, the kind of fan that he believed and the kind of product that the echo represents, the kind of hockey that he is essentially in the business of marketing. Mike talked about a different kind of journey, a journey for himself individually, his changing relationship with the game itself and what he likes about the game. What drew him to the game and what draws him to the game. Still, for this week's audio response, I want you to do something quite simple, and that is to analyze how you think each speaker would answer the following question.
Who do hockey players represent?
So when a hockey player plays hockey, who do they represent?
I'd like for you to again bring up points that, that, that you, that come to you. Certainly you can answer this point in terms of your own opinion on the answer to this question. But I also want you to analyze the way that you think Ryan and Mike would answer this question. The way that I want you to do that is say, well, you know, I think Mike would actually say this at 3 minutes and 55 seconds. He did mention this sort of part of his hockey journey. Or, you know, Ryan at 17 minutes said this, and I noticed a lot of you were doing that in your previous audio response. It makes it very, very, very helpful. So when I'm listening to it, I go right to that exact spot and say, ah, you know what, that's a really good point. So when you're going through those guest lectures, note down some things that are interesting about that, note down the ways in which they think they would answer that question, and note down ways in which that you think that support your interpretation of their answer to that question. It's a bit of a game of sort of trying to establish an argument using these two guest speakers, but overall, not a terribly complex question, just one that I think has interesting commonalities between the two speakers.
So this week we've had two guest lectures. We have a new assignment coming out next week. We'd have more discussion of that assignment. Right now I want you to start thinking about that, that Nice Dogs community engagement assignment. And I will see you all next week. I hope you have a wonderful week.
